Using a tank instead of radiator

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Davidhud29

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2010
Messages
323
Location
Gallatin TN
OK OK I know I'm new to the forum. But I can't find this answer anywhere. Some of you will think I'm retarded. I don't care, flame on. My question is this. I am building a car. I am considering different radiator locations and sizes. The motor is a mildly upgraded Ford 390. One option I am considering is using a small tank instead of a radiator. Maybe 5 gallons. I have a perfect spot for it. I just don't know if I could get the cooling I need. The motor and tank will be open to the elements so that will help with cooling, not being closed up in an engine compartment. I could also move the tank to the rear of the car giving a few more gallons of coolant and more piping to act as a heat radiator.
A Ford 8n tractor radiator would fit in the location up front as well because it's so small, (15" wide) close to a model A size I believe. Would a radiator this size be to small? I think I would prefer the tank idea. It's unique, and like I said Ihave the perfect spot up front already. My dad bought a big aluminum 3 core racing radiator he was going to install in the back. But I just don't like it.
 
A tank won't disperse the heat, but it will store it. Even using a larger capacity won't help in the end, it would only take longer to over heat. You will need to remove the heat from the coolant, and it seems the best way is still the old way, with a radiator. I don't know if a 8N rad has enough surface area or not, they aren't big in square inches, but if I remember right, they are fairly thick. Someone else can likely answer that part of the question, I've never tried it. Sniper
 
Sniper is right, at first the coolant would be ok, but as the temp came up it would just keep climbing. You need a radiator to disperse the heat. Don't feel bad, we've all thought of this same idea at one time or another.:D

Don
 
Ok ok

So that's what I figured on the tank. I'm sure it's been tried before. Just never heard of it personally.
So what about an 8N Ford tractor radiator? Or even a model A radiator. Remember I'm running a 390, but it is all open, no engine compartment.
 
hey i know you don't like your dad's idea of the radiator in the rear, but if you "hid" it with a cool louvered panel "tailgate" i think most wouldn't even realize it was there (by following it, or looking from behind)--i saw a model A sedan that was done this way--thought it was cool.......
 
The idea is ok... Just not sure where I would run the plumbing for it. Plus it seems like it over complicates things (he's good at that). And the bed isn't very big at all. Would like to utilize as much space as possible. I was considering filling in the back (tailgate) with metal. It will need some kind of protection for the radiator, screen, etc., not just outside but also inside. So nothing in the bed would damage it. Filling it in and doing louvers sounds pretty cool. If the inside was closed up to; the radiator would be pretty enclosed. Too much maybe...
 
If you are looking for a radiator that fits inside a Model A shell, a '66 mustang radiator fits great. It's a few inches shorter than the A shell, but the same width.

I'm running an aluminum one I got from Speedway ($300) with an elec fan on my 302. I sit at alot of stoplights in 100 deg city heat and have had no probs with it keeping up. I believe mine is only a 2-row but of course they sell 3 and 4 row for additional cooling (and $$).
 
I was wondering about a copper tubing radiator for something different. Like
2" tube top and bottom for the tanks and 1/2" running up and down,maybe staggered in two rows.Would it work or would it be just a stupid idea. I have lots of those!
 
I was wondering about a copper tubing radiator for something different. Like
2" tube top and bottom for the tanks and 1/2" running up and down,maybe staggered in two rows.Would it work or would it be just a stupid idea. I have lots of those!

My guess is ... no. Not enough surface area to dissipate heat to the air. Study a radiator. Lots and lots of surface area on all those little fins.

I have seen a air cooled motor where it had a bid fan and air manifold that blew air over the exposed cylinder walls - very strange looking. Is that how old airplane engines were cooled?
 
I was wondering about a copper tubing radiator for something different. Like
2" tube top and bottom for the tanks and 1/2" running up and down,maybe staggered in two rows.Would it work or would it be just a stupid idea. I have lots of those!

Nothing stupid about it, take a look at the very early 'Horseless carrage' and what you describe is exactly what they used. But, they also were only running 8-10 hp and the demand wasn't that great on the engine, so it was able to keep it cooled down enough. The copper 'bee hive constructed core' style came shortly after those. They were able to keep the large water cooled aircraft engines cooled, but they themselves as a rad, were large and heavy for aircraft. Vehicles and their builders soon adopted the bee hive style as well, because of the enormous surface area, it worked.
 
Yeah, many of the old radial airplane engines had the barrels behind the prop which would blow enough air (plus the air flowing through the prop when the plane was moving) to cool the barrels. Some even had the crank stationary and the barrels turned and the prop was connected to the same frame (block) as the barrels, a weird setup but it worked fine. One of the Russian V8's was air cooled also the Deutz diesels many of them were air cooled with a big fan blowing down a shroud and tunnel which blew over the cylinder barrels keeping the cool not unlike a VW just inline instead. But diesels are another matter and in many cases its hard to get them hot enough (why you often see part of the radiator plugged off with a zip up apron on the front).

Regards,

Rev. Don
 
Is you ride chanelled? I am going to put the radiator under the cab below the driveline in my truck, it will have a sheet metal box around it with an electric fan on top. How this works is that the front of the box is open and has a deflector to send the incoming air up onto the top, the other end of the box is closed and the air can only go through the radiator and out the bottom of the box through holes, louvers or mesh. This will work fine while moving but when sitting the fan is on top and it blows down through and out.

You are right, when saying that the engine is now air cooled also, as it is out in the front without any sheet metal around it, and no hot air coming through the radiator and over the engine heating it up, and the exhaust is out in the wind sending it's heat away from the engine too. This setup hides the radiator and ugly electric fan in a place not used for anything and is easier on your water pump than sending the water clear back to the tailgate and back.
 
Build one of these, don't think it'll work, could be fun!
 

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The other thing to remember about the old air-cooled Pratt & Whitney [airplane] motors was the operating altitude. Even in the south Pacific the ambient air temperature at 20k feet is much cooler. So while some of the old fighters might start getting warm idling on the tarmac too long, it was a different story at 300mph and 30,000'.

Still, those big radials had to have oil coolers and pretty generous cowl openings to stay cool also.


Fred B.
 
Is you ride chanelled? I am going to put the radiator under the cab below the driveline in my truck, it will have a sheet metal box around it with an electric fan on top. How this works is that the front of the box is open and has a deflector to send the incoming air up onto the top, the other end of the box is closed and the air can only go through the radiator and out the bottom of the box through holes, louvers or mesh. This will work fine while moving but when sitting the fan is on top and it blows down through and out.

You are right, when saying that the engine is now air cooled also, as it is out in the front without any sheet metal around it, and no hot air coming through the radiator and over the engine heating it up, and the exhaust is out in the wind sending it's heat away from the engine too. This setup hides the radiator and ugly electric fan in a place not used for anything and is easier on your water pump than sending the water clear back to the tailgate and back.

Clear back to the tailgate is only about 6' maybe. But that is farther than a stocker. No room under neath as it's only 6" off the ground. Still thinking of putting it in the back with a vented tailgate.
 
You don't have to stand it upright you can lay it flat under the bed you just have to have a way of pulling, or pushing air through it. Also if you have a fabricated frame you could route the water through the frame it is a lot of work tho.
 
I'm going to be doing pretty much what you describe when I get back on finishing up my 29 RPU. I want it to have a Moon tank up front and and empty Model A grille shell ala drag car. So I am putting an aluminum radiator on it's side with a pusher fan below to aid air flow when I'm not moving. I may build in some ducting to channel the air from under the car through it too.

I am going to use a louvered tonneau cover that my Son had for the car when it was his, and probably punch more louvers in the tailgate to vent it better.

Here is how I am doing mine, and it will be cooling a 406 CI Olds engine. BTW, those 390 Fords like a LOT of cooling. :)

Don


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Garlits used to run a water tank on his dragster,
worked well during staging battles.

It would also work well on a show car, or trailer queen.
Anywhere else, the size of the tank only changes the
amount of time before it overheats.
 

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