'74 Ventura sub swap?

[Rad Rob]

I haven't had the chance to measure the WMS to determine if it's close to my '53 Poncho but I've got a friend with a '74 Ventura (NOVA) that's getting parted out. I need to replace or repair my front suspension because I've got a lower controll arm with rot so bad the coil popped out. So I thought this sub might make a good swap and give me updated brakes. It's got a running 250 Chevy six in it (looks to be Chevy trans pattern not BOP) and I can get the whole deal for about $400-$500. I've got a WC t-5 trans and a 3.73 posi rear out of an '83 camaro which I think would make that six come alive.

OR I can use the 305 I already have, bolt on an edelbrock intake, holley carb and the HEI dist. (I have those parts already) and throw that in the '74 sub. I think the '74 already has holes for V8 motor mounts and they SHOULD be chevy mounts because of the year of the car. I think I could get the sub for about $200 which is cheaper than trying to find the parts I need for my suspension and swapping to disk brakes, plus I'd gain power steering and I could use the Camaro steering column and the old school grant wheel I've been saving. Another bonus of that is I stole the wiring harness with fuse block from the camaro so I should be able to make the turn signal switch work AND the keyed ignition work in my '53.

I have the tools to swap in the sub and I'm confident in my welding ability but I'm still nervous about cutting my frame. I think it's worth the effort and I'm sure I can pull it off. I'm just thinking out loud because this is my first sub frame swap. I'm doing it only from what I've read in magazines and online so I need real advise.

 

[Tripper]

Crossmember swaps!

Rob,
There are several other ways to go like a crossmember & Mustang II setup. That way u're not cuttin' u're frame.

BoB

 

[babyface]

S10's

Seen lots of S10 grafts on old 50's stuff too!

BF

 

[Rad Rob]

Seen lots of S10 grafts on old 50's stuff too!

BF

The S-10 stuff is way too narrow for my taste. I like the wheels right at or just inside the body.

I had thought about a mustang II setup but the cost of the kits is more than what I'd like to spend.

 

[babyface]

Junkyard dog!

I had thought about a mustang II setup but the cost of the kits is more than what I'd like to spend.

Rob
The crossmembers are only around $400-$450 & then you can go to any junkyard & get the MII parts cheap! Just a thought & that setup handles great, my buddy runs them on all his cars!

BF

 

[Rad Rob]

Rob
The crossmembers are only around $400-$450 & then you can go to any junkyard & get the MII parts cheap! Just a thought & that setup handles great, my buddy runs them on all his cars!

BF

$400-$450 is a lot of money in my eyes for a cross-member and then I have to find a Mustang II in a junkyard (hard to do around here) which will cost me how much more for the suspension? I'd be into the front end for about $700 by the time it was said and done. It's not that I don't like the idea, but that's out of my price range... heck... that's almost my entire budget in itself.

 

[Rad Rob]

Here's what I have in the car so far:

$2,500 bought the complete car w/ engine, trans, rear, chassis, body, all trim.

$200- sold some parts so... $140 '83 camaro parts car
-3.73 posi 10 bolt rear
-4 Z28 wheels
-Non tilt, std. trans steering column
-chrome grand 3 spoke wheel
-305 engine w/ 80K
-blown t-5 trans w/ pedal assy and bellhousing
-wiring harness w/ fuse block
-parking brake handle

$250 world class t-5 from '90 camaro

$50 door linkages I was missing and trim for windows

So right now I have $2,940 in this car but I hope to sell the straight 6 as it was rebuilt before I got the car, the Z28 wheels, the stock pontiac rear and 3 speed trans to recoup some money.

I'm aiming for this car to be at or under $3,500.

 

[Gastrick]

Rob, You may not even be able to get a crossmember kit for that car. Most likely you would have to get a frame stub from someone like Fatman Fabrications because of the width. I didn't see a cross member listed for your application. I think they are more money than you want to spend, based on what you have said thus far.

Grafting a front frame clip isn't that bad of a job to do. The most important part is making sure that you square and level everything up before welding it together and making sure the splice is strong and safe. If you decide you want to go that route, There are plenty of people here that have done it before and can help you along the way.

 

[Rad Rob]

I'm definitely interested in some information on how to graft the sub-frame onto my car.

I've called several companies for brake parts, leaf springs, front suspensions and everything has to be custom made... the prices I was quoted made my heart stop for a few seconds.

I think I found a 70's firebird as well as this ventura, are there major differences between the two?

 

[WIZEGUY]

All the F-body stuff is the same.

I can give you some basic tips on what to do, but you will need to do your own research and check all the facts, (even mine), before you begin.
Make sure you understand completely before moving forward.

The first thing would be to get the car/truck up so you can see and measure carefully, and make sure you develop a good game plan.

I would first measure and record wheelbase and front and REAR track width.
(There is nothing worse than seeing the front tires sticking out more than the rears.)
I would then level the chassis front to back and left to right.

After doing this you are going to have to measure the width of the subframe and the frame you are grafting into. You need to determine if you need to taper the subframe or make it wider at the graft point. If this needs to be done 3/16" to 1/4" plate will do fine.

To determine the graft point you are going to need to figure where the wheel c/l on the subframe needs to be located to put the wheelbase back to "stock" location.

If everything is going to work out, you need to install some type of temp. cross braces on the factory frame before cutting it apart. Measure to make sure the frame is square before and after the cut. Also make sure a frame rail doesn't "pop" up or down. Plenty of x-bracing will help this.

Sometimes factory subframes develop a twist in them over the years of use and abuse. If you find yours has this problem you may need to "tweak" the subframe as you tack weld things together. Good ways to push and pull are left up to you and what you have to work with.

Remember to measure, measure, and measure, to make sure everything is level, square and straight.

Dropping lines and points on the floor off of the factory frame, using a plumb bob, helps in this process.
A center line running down the length of the chassis and a perpendicular line at the wheelbase point, will give you a good reference point to work off of.

But again you need to determine that the factory frame is straight before relying on this method.

Make plenty of notes and sketches before beginning.

Remember you are going to need to remount front sheetmetal, core support, bumper mounts, steering column, brake lines, and your tranny mount may not line back up due to the new motor mount location.
Look at all these things.

These are very,very basic instructions. There are alot of little tips and tricks to making this go smoother.
Ask plenty of questions and I'm sure alot of people on here can help you with this.
Hope this helps....

 

[lanechange70]

Try measuring the k-member under the 83 cam(it bolts in) it maybe able to cut the crossmember from yours then use gm metric upper arms and spindles, try trading cars for parts you need at the boneyard seen one last year at Fathers Day show in Belvider Ill. The Owner fabbed upper mounts from race car parts, made it 100% bolt-in, used stock steering. I believe It was a 42 buick 4 door

 

[Rad Rob]

Try measuring the k-member under the 83 cam(it bolts in) it maybe able to cut the crossmember from yours then use gm metric upper arms and spindles, try trading cars for parts you need at the boneyard seen one last year at Fathers Day show in Belvider Ill. The Owner fabbed upper mounts from race car parts, made it 100% bolt-in, used stock steering. I believe It was a 42 buick 4 door

I got rid of the '83 already. I think I got your idea though, it sounds pretty good. I'll see what I can come up with.

Right now I have to find a job though. I got fired on monday because there was money missing from the cash box my boss left in the waiting room with a bunch of low life customers... he blamed me for it because I was working that day and won't pay me. I hate thieves but more than that I hate being called a thief!

 

[tommy1969]

i just bought a 55 ford with a 78 trans am front subframe grafted on,the cars still def. a project,but i just drove it down the road tonight ,and it drives great.handles nice ,even retains original sway bar,if you have the parts cheap enough ,id say measure ,measure ,measure,and do it ,i love mine