My Engine Vat

[hotrodbill]

Tecnically, this isn't a tool, but since I changed the water in my "engine vat" today I thought I would take some pictures and share them.

Here she is, a 55 gallon drum with a lid.

On the front is a thermostat for an electric hot water heater.

On the back, at the bottom, is a heating element for an electric hot water heater. It is a 110 volt, 2000 watt element. It's the highest wattage 110v one I coud find. It take a while to heat the barrel up from cold but it will doi it (about 8 hours). You can get elements in 220 volts up to 5500 watts, you can also wire up dual elements.
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Here is an engine that has just finished its bath. I have bailed out several gallons of water to expose the engine.
It's a 1980 Ford 302, and it was nASSty. I didn't take any "before" pictures though.

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Stubborn (head gasket) material that would take endless scraping peels right off. If it won't peel off then one swipe from a razor blde take it clean off.

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The carbon in EGR passages can be hard as concrete, but many times after a bath the carbon breaks apart like sand.

This carbon was a little tougher, but a few seconds with a screwdriver and this passage is clean.

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Before a squirt from the water hose.

Notice how the oil pan gasket came off in one strip.

 

[hotrodbill]

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The block and head casting was really grainy and rough.

WTF?!! No valve stem seals! Maybe they disolved or broke away inside the engine.

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After I have bailed out all the dirty water, I tip the barren upside down over a bucket and spray out the sludge.

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Heres the element.

I place a piece of channel iron over it to keep it from getting damaged. There is a piece of angle iron in there too so blocks will sit level across the bottom. And it leaves a gap so water can circulate under the engine too.

I fill it 3/4 full, thats enough to cover most any engine.

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This is the stuff that makes it all melt away.

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The engine that I showed may not look clean but the pictures don't do it justice. The block casting was VERY rough, almost like 40 grit sand paper. It was striped to the bare metal.

I will clean about 5 engines (block and heads) between fluid changes, depending on how dirty each one is.

You can fit a Big Block Chevy (block and heads) in a 55 gallon drum.

I clean my engines this way mainly for inspection purpouses. I know that the best way to clean an engine is to bake and blast it.

Price to pay a machine shop to vat ONE engine, around $50 (2002 was the last time I paid for the service, so I'm sure it cost more now).
Total investment in this "engine vat" is about $40 ($60 if you have to buy the barrel too, I already had one).

 

[donsrods]

That's actually very inventive. Have you experimented with different caustic chemicals to see if they give different results?

Don

 

[dmw56]

Good idea, but how do you dispose of the used caustic oily soup??

 

[hotrodbill]

Good idea, but how do you dispose of the used caustic oily soup??

Personally, I use it as herbicide around all my junk/cars/fence-line.

Before the tree-huggers have a heart attack, this stuff isn't as toxic as you think. It is Alkaline (the opposite of Acid), so it works not because it is poison but because it makes the soil alkaline. The really tough weeds (tumbleweeds, sand burrs, those with the needle covered leaves and big purple flowers) will still grow because the alkaline soil doesn't phase them. I keep those weeds in check with Round-Up.

The oil is emulsified, meaning the molecular bond is broken. It's no longer oily, it disperses in the water. Much the same way Dawn dish soap gets your dishes clean.

The sludge/sediment/crud (dirt, carbon, gasket material) that sinks to the bottom, I funnel it into empty jugs and throw it into the dumpster.

I'm not saying this stuff is safe to drink, and the powder will definetly cause chemical burns, so use caution while handling it.
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If a guy wanted to, you could pour it down the drain. After all, it IS just drain cleaner. It might even still clean your sewer pipes.

The dookie and urine you flush down the toilet is probably more toxic. In fact your blood is slighty alkaline (just above water), so we humans are TOXIC!

 

[hotrodbill]

That's actually very inventive. Have you experimented with different caustic chemicals to see if they give different results?

Don

Yes I have:laundry detergent, and dish soap....neither of which worked very good. Neither is very cost effective either.
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Some quick FYI,

#1-Tide (the laundry detergent) has Lye in it. It can also be used, I have done it myself, but I don't recommend it. The problem with Tide is that it also has OTHER chemicals/fragrance/stuff in it, and you have to use a LOT to get the same cleaning power as straight Lye. Tide is about 9% Lye, and there is so much perfume in it.... the steam will gag you.

#2-Lye is also called "sodium hydroxide" or "potash", it is a powder or chrystal.

#3-You used to be able to buy Lye in 50# and 8# containers at most hardware stores. Plumbers called it "sanitary lye", and used it to sanitize the area wherever sewage spills occured.
Now the 1# bottles are about all you can find, most hardware stores and some grocery stores have it. It's with all the other drain cleaners.

The only way to buy it in large quantites now is from a chemical supply house.

#4-DO NOT use liquid drain cleaner, that stuff is totally different. DO NOT use Drain-Out crystals, or simmilar products. They contain other chemicals and aluminum. MAKE SURE what you use is 100% LYE.

#5-Lye is used in the production of "Meth", no I don't know how. In some communities Lye is regulated and you have to show ID and signature for it. I suspect this is one reason why you can't find it in bulk anymore.

#6-Lye is used to make hominy, that corn dish we love to hate. (I hated hominy as a kid, now it's not so bad)

#7-Lye is "alkaline" or "base", which is opposite of acid on the Ph scale. It can be neutralized with vinegar (which is acidic).

#8-Lye is hygroscopic (it will absorb moisture from the air and disolve), so it MUST be stored in a sealed container.

#9-Legend has it, the Mob would use Lye to dispose of bodies. They would cover the body with lye in the grave. It could destroy any evidence and and decompose a body in as little as 24 hours.

#10-Lye has been used to make soap for centuries.
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I start fresh with 3# (thats 3 bottles) in the barrel, if after a couple of engines I notice a decrease in cleaning power I will add another bottle. Anything past 5# you might as well change the water, clean the vat, and start fresh.

 

[Sniper]

Cool stuff, I learned quite a bit from this thread. Thanks.

 

[NewIronRats]

Great Idea. Im hunting up a 55 gallon drum now.[P[

 

[klink]

While you're at it... hook a DC power source like a battery charger to it. Attach the ground to the part and the positive to an electrode, stainless rod works well... and turn it on. This will convert the rust, can't remember the technical name but it'll be black. Make sure the electrode doesn't contact the part.

 

[hotrodbill]

I have built an electrolisys bath before. They do work to a certian extent.
#1, you cant use a steel barrel....it will corrode through it quickly. Even if you wanted to use a steel barrel, the part being cleaned couldn't be allowed to touch the sides or bottom, it would have to remain suspended some how.
#2, you have to have a good source of DC voltage. Yes a battery charger will work.....for small parts. To do something the size of a complete car engine you really need to push about 100 amps through it or it will take several days.
#3, it actually weakens and removes a very fine layer of metal from the surface depending on how long you leave it. Not a good thing if you want to keep engine tolerances as tight as possible.

I feel like an electrolisys bath is geared more towards HEAVILY rusted and corroded objects, like something you found in the dirt.
The one I built was used to clean a cast iron, 1957, 9hp Briggs Stratton engine. The cooling fins had a lot of rust scale in them, and it was very difficult to get between the fins. With my battery charger set at 55 amps it still took 18 hours to get it clean, the tin parts took about 2 hours each.

A plastic bucket or Rubbermaid trash can or tub works, but like I said, better for small stuff.

 

[klink]

An engine block would be a big job for a battery charger, but I do wheels all the time and I use a steel tank. One wheel takes about 10 amps.

The part and electrode need to be isolated, or the steel tank won't last. The process doesn't remove any un-oxidized metal, only the rust gets converted. The parts must be rinsed and protected immediately after being removed though or they'll skin over with a layer of rust.

Adding electrolysis to the heat would be a plus, that's why I suggested it. The electrolysis process without heat doesn't do a good job of removing grime or paint, which is why I use a steel tank with a heating element.

 

[dark_horse]

The drum/engine vat is an impressive idea, sure looks to be better than a case of engine degreaser and a wire brush. I think I'll try to rig one up for myself.

 

[bgbrktracer]

Engine bath

OK guys I have a question. What does the lye soak do to aluminum? Nevermind, was a dumb question.

 

[tractorman44]

Interesting thread concerning lye and how it works. We butcher all our own beef and pork and have for decades. We render the lard out of the pig fat and use it with lye to make our home made soap just like granny used to...well almost. Granny used to use ashes from the cook stove to create her own lye and consequently sometimes the soap was quite ...aaaaaa....harsh !! With todays lye crystals, there is no guesswork as to the mixture of triglycerides to sodium hydroxides so the end result can be pre-determined.

The triglycerides in the fat combine with the sodium hydroxide molecules in the lye and thorugh a process called 'soponification' we end up with some of the best grease-cutting hand soap money can't buy !!!