Parallel front leafs + Air?

[70Newport]

Hey Everyone!

So im in the process of attempting to set up my front steering and suspension. I am hoping to keep the Parallel leafs and solid front axle that came with the car but with doing air ride as well I have been racking my brain to figure out HOW! I have tried finding pictures and threads about this and have had no luck. Im sure I'm not the first person to do this (although that would be a fun claim to fame)

If I fail ill probably end up with a crown vic K member going on

Thanks for any and all help!

 

[Dr Crankenstein]

Leaf springs or air springs... pick one.

You're trying to invent a flying submarine... lighter than air, heavier than water.

No offense or insult intended... you'd have to eliminate the leaf spring's ability to support weight and replace it with the air spring, on demand, while maintaining critical geometry.

That said, you can have air on a beam axle without the parallel leafs. DozerII's Essex build uses a beam axle formerly attached to parallel leafs...

http://ratrodsrule.com/forum/showthread.php?t=34026
.

 

[King Herald]

Do you want to raise and lower, or just add some extra spring? If it is the former you may need to remove some leafs out of the spring to allow it to move, and then you may need to fit ladder bars or similar to stop axle wrap under braking.

What exactly will the air bags be for, is the key question.

 

[kenny c]

[S More info and pics please.

 

[Old Iron]

[P[P[P

 

[70Newport]

Do you want to raise and lower, or just add some extra spring? If it is the former you may need to remove some leafs out of the spring to allow it to move, and then you may need to fit ladder bars or similar to stop axle wrap under braking.

What exactly will the air bags be for, is the key question.

The air is just meant to raise and lower in the front. The rear i will be using it as the actual suspension. I was thinking I could pull out a couple leafs and run the air bag on top of the leaf spring between it and the frame so that aired out the leaf would basically be flat or arched down (high spot in the middle) and then when aired up the bag would actually be the suspension just held by the spring.....almost like how trucks will sometimes have helper bags in the rear but a little more extreme.... if this is a terrible idea im ok with someone saying so

 

[70Newport]

Leaf springs or air springs... pick one.

You're trying to invent a flying submarine... lighter than air, heavier than water.

No offense or insult intended... you'd have to eliminate the leaf spring's ability to support weight and replace it with the air spring, on demand, while maintaining critical geometry.

That said, you can have air on a beam axle without the parallel leafs. DozerII's Essex build uses a beam axle formerly attached to parallel leafs...

http://ratrodsrule.com/forum/showthread.php?t=34026
.

thanks for that build thread. its a great build to go through.

I know its seems odd but I feel like someone somewhere has done it. Im hoping for the look of the parallel leafs and the up/down function of the air. If it can't be done then thats alright but its worth the effort to try and do something different.

 

[sneakysnake]

Well it's probably not going to look very pretty but it can be done.You could heavily Z the frame to get it lower then extend the shackle to give you some travel and use an overload bag, or some other options are cantalever like in the picks.

 

[Blue Eyed Devil]

if this is a terrible idea im ok with someone saying so

I'll say it - It's a terrible idea. Using what is left of a leaf spring in an attempt to locate an axle is not only ineffective but dangerous. Spring steel is not meant to behave that way. Continually over-arcing a spring will stretch and fatigue the material and it WILL fail. There is a reason that front suspension setups are so well documented - because they work. Don't let the failure of one be your "claim to fame".

 

[70Newport]

Thanks everyone for your input. I didn’t think this was such an odd idea with the idea of trucks running a helper bag but clearly it’s not my best idea. I’ll revist other ideas instead. Probably end up ditching the solid front axle unfortunately but I’ll live with that.

Thanks again!

 

[Blue Eyed Devil]

The difference is what you are proposing isn't a truck running a helper bag. It is employing the bag as the main working suspension component and subjecting the spring leaf to far more movement than it was ever intended to have. Plenty of front airbag suspension setups out there that employ a solid axle without using what is left of a leaf spring to locate it. Research those.

 

[DozerII]

My Essex has this style front suspension, and if I hadn't gone IFS on the Fast Four this is what I would have used. And the only reason I went IFS is cuz I'm running fenders. Link below

http://westtexasplasma.com/product/beam-axel-hidden-air-ride-kit/?v=3e8d115eb4b3

 

[70Newport]

My Essex has this style front suspension, and if I hadn't gone IFS on the Fast Four this is what I would have used. And the only reason I went IFS is cuz I'm running fenders. Link below

http://westtexasplasma.com/product/beam-axel-hidden-air-ride-kit/?v=3e8d115eb4b3

Thanks DozerII! I dig that style and your build is awesome. Im going to play around and see if I can build something like that. How does it ride?

 

[DozerII]

Thanks DozerII! I dig that style and your build is awesome. Im going to play around and see if I can build something like that. How does it ride?

It rides and handles very well, and we have some of the worst roads in the country. The odometer just hit 5100 miles at the start of the third summer so it's a driver.

You want to go with the largest airbag you can, depending on the motor your using and the weight. The larger the airbag the less air pressure you need to hold up the weight , the smoother the ride.

 

[70Newport]

It rides and handles very well, and we have some of the worst roads in the country. The odometer just hit 5100 miles at the start of the third summer so it's a driver.

You want to go with the largest airbag you can, depending on the motor your using and the weight. The larger the airbag the less air pressure you need to hold up the weight , the smoother the ride.

i should have a pleanty big enough air bag as they came out of a big tow rig. Do you know why it is needed to have the “pivot arms” I’m going to call them under the air bags? Would It work to just run the bags basically where the leafs previously were and then run basically a wishbone front setup to the bag mount.... just a thought.

 

[8 Deuces]

i should have a pleanty big enough air bag as they came out of a big tow rig. Do you know why it is needed to have the “pivot arms” I’m going to call them under the air bags? Would It work to just run the bags basically where the leafs previously were and then run basically a wishbone front setup to the bag mount.... just a thought.

Forgive me for being an idiot and not knowing what works or doesn't work or is safe or dangerous...LOL I own a couple Rat Rods but I couldn't build a lego rat rod much less something I could drive...HOWEVER, I have seen exactly what you are looking to do and had to dig though years of photos to find it and here it is.... Obviously this guy drove it to a car show but I can't tell you whether he is still alive since is saw it! HAHA

 

[70Newport]

Forgive me for being an idiot and not knowing what works or doesn't work or is safe or dangerous...LOL I own a couple Rat Rods but I couldn't build a lego rat rod much less something I could drive...HOWEVER, I have seen exactly what you are looking to do and had to dig though years of photos to find it and here it is.... Obviously this guy drove it to a car show but I can't tell you whether he is still alive since is saw it! HAHA

lol thanks for the reply! this is a little different than I was hoping to do as I wanted to do parallel leafs not a single leaf but I have abandoned running leafs and air bags. that is a cool build though and i really appreciate the picture!