Spacing fenders out on 37 Buick

[Mutt's37Buick]

I'm looking for a quick and dirty way to space the fenders out on my '37 Buick Roadmaster. I'm considering suspensions that are a little wider than my car and interested in adding spacers to the joint between the fenders and the body. I've heard it takes 8 hours to widen each fender, even when your and expert.
I don't need wider fenders, just need the front fenders shifted 2" out and the back shifted 3" out. Ideally the fenders would not be modified, just a spacer bolted in between. The spacer part could be painted to match the body. Has anyone ever done this, and how did you accomplish it. Pictures would be great if possible.
Thanks for your help.

 

[Blue Eyed Devil]

Leave it on the original chassis.

Problem solved.

Besides, why are you considering something that is going to literally mutilate a car that was purchased new by your grandfather? I would think it means a lot to you (or it should), so I think this is a case where you can save money and do things properly instead of "quick and dirty"...

My $.02

 

[dmw56]

Find a suspension that fits right. Don't just cobble it together do it right!

 

[HOT40ROD]

Question. What suspension are you looking at?

Keep in mind doing a 2 inch spacer is also a lot of work. No only do you need the spacer but you will also need to make or modify all the fender braces. If not the fender will flap in the wind and end up with a lot of stress cracks.

Off set wheel can work but they would look like front wheel drive wheels.

 

[donsrods]

The image I get in my mind from doing something like that is not pretty.........in fact, downright hideous comes to mind. Sorry, that is what I think.

I can't imagine too many suspensions that would be wider than a Buick, what are you considering, an F 350 Ford truck frame? Do it right and don't just stick something that is way out of proportion under there just because you have it or can get it cheap. I realize this is a rat rod forum, but rat rodders too want to say with pride "Yep, I built this myself" when asked. Those early days of rat rods being tossed together without regard to looks and function are long gone..........Praise the Lord.

There is a lot of good help available on here, let some of those people steer you in the right direction. You might now always like what you hear, but it is given in the right spirit. Doing it right the first time takes more work, but sure is worth the extra effort.

Don

 

[Mutt's37Buick]

Thanks everyone for your honest feedback.
Most I asked thought spacers were was a bad idea. This my first street rod, and I thought it would work and prevent me from splitting and widening the fenders. I'm going to learn to weld and do sheetmetall, but spacers seemed like a way that would be easier for a a beginner and would be reversible if I was not happy with the results.
The real decision is what to do on the front suspension. The Crown Vic front suspension looked like quallity suspension, I could install with just a little help. The CV a front track of 63.4. Without changing the fenders, the front track on my Buick needs to be 57" to 57.5" so I can run wider tires. This '37 Buick will weigh about 3800lbs after I swap the drive train. I want to build it as a reliable driver with disk brakes, power steering, and ball joints. I do not want to clip & change the front clip, use a aftermarket mustang II, or use a Jag suspension.
Any other supension ideas would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks for your help.

 

[donsrods]

What are your objections to using a MMII front end or Nova clip like everyone else does? They are easy to adapt, work great, and there is a huge selection of kits out there.

Aside from the issue of creating a lot of work for yourself, just think what that Buick is going to look like with widened fenders.

Don

 

[Blue Eyed Devil]

A MII will not be any harder to install than anything else - It will be MUCH easier. Crossmembers are available for your specific frame width, and your suspension options are pretty much whatever you want (tubular A-arms, coliovers, aribags, etc.). Sure it's a little spendy out of the gate, but prices on these type setups have come way down in recent years - and think about what you are facing otherwise.

Leaving the car on the stock chassis retains all of your mounting points for fenders, body, core support, etc etc. When you lose that, these are what become virtual nightmares in swap/clip type situations. Not to mention the cost of rebuilding/repairing whatever used suspension is being considered. When you add it all up it's a no-brainer. Not to mention it will make the end result MUCH more aesthetically pleasing and valuable. You could have a MII under that car in a weekend and have all the required components you are looking for and it will drive like a dream. Compare that to hacking up what looks like a pretty nice car that has family history to you.

All this is especially important if you don't even know how to weld yet. You are going to have to have someone do the frame work for you, and in that case the MII is an even more viable and cost-effective option. The labor on a MII install will be WAY less than doing a clip, especially if you have removed all the front sheetmetal first. After that and the motor/trans mounts are done you can bolt the frontend back on and be done with it. I know you are new to this, but myself and the other guys here are really looking out for the best interests of you and the car. Consider it...

 

[Daman]

When I first started measuring I figured I'd have to do something like this on the rear and maybe the front.

I envisioned taking C channel and notching it all the way around so it would bend the radius I wanted and just welding tabs up under the notches to mount the fender and body.

Once everything was going together...all my time measuring went out the door. nothing had to be spaced, everything fits. Granted it's a pickup and not a car and the bed was lifted about 4 inches (just for looks).

Maybe once you get going you can look for rims with a lot of back spacing (newer ones) Maybe from a Buick and you wont have a problem

[P

 

[Mutt's37Buick]

The aftermarket manufacturers say my car is boarderline for Mustang II because of the weight. I've heard many say it will be fine, but just as many who say it is not a good application.
Aside from that and the cost for new mustang II, I would rather find used parts that were manufactured by auto manufacturers. That way I can choose parts from reliable tried a proven cars. Besides, cars with mustang II and crate GM engines are everywhere. The cars that are more interesting to me at car shows are the ones with a unique approach. A wider suspension was actually attractive to me for that reason.
I'll be back with alternatives I find to see what you all think.
Thanks again for your feedback.

 

[bob w]

http://www.industrialchassisinc.com/Web-blog/?page_id=2

Talk to this guy, el Polacko on the HAMB about using a Dakota front in your car. He is very helpful and knows a lot.

 

[Whatever]

Ever thought about just selling it before you F&^%#@ it all up and your Grampa kicks you in the nuts for destroying his car ?? Sounds like you need to go find some POS and learn to weld on it .................. Whatever

 

[Mutt's37Buick]

Chevy Van suspension on '37 Buick

Here is a different approach that I'm considering. Won't handle as well as some options, but would allow me to utilize some of the existing independent suspension.

I ran across the following description written by a hotrodder named Rgreen on:
http://forums.aaca.org/f120/37-buick...-195177-2.html

"Re: 37 buick suspension upgrade
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, just in case anyone wants the final version. I did the upgrade, am willing to share more details but here is the quick and dirty. I used the stock Buick lower arms, welded in a plate to accept a 90 astro van ball joint. used the 90 astro van spindles, brakes, hoses, calipers and 12 inch vented rotors. Used a 90 full size van upper arm, used the same 90 upper bracket which the upper arm is bolted to. Unscrewed the buick tie rod end and then just screwed in the astro van tierod end fit perfect. Used the astro van power booster and proportioning valves. Since I used the stock steering box, tie rods, and lower arms there shoulb be no bump steer. If you want specific details as to how I set it up for caster and camber and antidive please feel free to contact me. This front end set-up was basically free since I paid 200 for the van, sold the trans for 100, sold the tires for another 100. And still have parts to sell. It took about 20 hours to make the change overs, including cleaning and painting it. I saved all the parts I removed and just in case someone wants to take it back to orginal all you would have to buy or find is stock lower arms.

Thanks for the interesting chatting, to begin with I was afraid of the tech aspects, but after hours of internet searching I feel very comfortable with this upgrade and it was easier than I expected."

1) I've been trying to contact Rgreen (Ray Green of Sacramento), but no luck so far. He was also a member of Hotrodders.com in 2004. Have any of you ever communicated with him?
2) This sounds like a pretty straight forward change that allows minimal changes but adds ball joints and power disk brakes. What are your opinions?
I also want to explore using only components from the full size van just to simplify.
Thanks

 

[Blue Eyed Devil]

The aftermarket manufacturers say my car is boarderline for Mustang II because of the weight. I've heard many say it will be fine, but just as many who say it is not a good application.
Aside from that and the cost for new mustang II, I would rather find used parts that were manufactured by auto manufacturers. That way I can choose parts from reliable tried a proven cars. Besides, cars with mustang II and crate GM engines are everywhere. The cars that are more interesting to me at car shows are the ones with a unique approach. A wider suspension was actually attractive to me for that reason.
I'll be back with alternatives I find to see what you all think.
Thanks again for your feedback.

Wanna know why MII's get used a lot? Because they WORK - and they work well. There are thousands of "tried and proven" cars out there with aftermarket MII setups that work great, get driven a ton and still weigh more than your Buick. It's a fat fendered car where the suspension can't be seen, so set it up to drive, drive well and LOOK right. There are a million earlier hot rods out there with dropped I-beam front axles. Does anybody complain about that? No - because it looks right and functions right on the car.

Wanna know what's interesting at a car show? The bitchin' lookin' car that got driven hundreds or thousands of miles to be there - not some cobbled together turd that limped in from down the street because it's "different". Like I said before, you are getting good advice from seasoned builders here. These guys are trying to help out a noob, and you aren't listening. I'm really not trying to be a hard-on here, but guys that have been around a while see situations like this all too often. I guess you will learn your lessons the hard way, and unfortunately a cool old car with some neat history stands in the way.

That being said - Good luck with your project. I hope it doesn't wind up like so many others we see...

 

[Whatever]

Hope you didn't do the welding since you posted you're gonna learn how. Control arms aren't a good place for pratice welds .....................

 

[Mutt's37Buick]

Haven't learned to weld yet, but I wouldnt do the welding on any critical parts like the suspension.
Is that a common practice for an experienced welder to weld plates for ball joints?

 

[HOT40ROD]

I have not mess with GM car much. But if the Buick frame is the same as the 37 Chevy Chassis Engineering make a bolt in mustang II crossmember.

Check them out at www.chassisengineeringinc.com

An other choice could be a Mopar torsion bar suspension from the 70's Part are getting hard to come by for these suspensions. But they are easy to install in most cars.

 

[Sam_Fear]

Check out the cost on the above posted link for disc brake and repair kits for the stock suspension. It's a lot cheaper and easier than a MII or a front clip swap. If you want wider tires, get rims with a little more back spacing.