Steering issues - pulling

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BigIrish

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 1, 2009
Messages
1,382
Location
Houston, TX
I was able to take the car out for only the second time today. The steering is kind of all over the place. Hit the gas, it pulls to the left (drivers side), jump off the gas, pulls to the right.

I've tried toe in and toe out, but it didn't change anything. The entire front end is brand new including the steering box and everything is tight. It's not a wobble, but a pull.

Any ideas?? I'm wondering if I don't have enough caster angle in the front.
 
How much castor angle do you have?

Also, if you are using drum brakes, check the adjustment to see if you have equal brake pull on each side.
 
What should I be checking - to make sure the axle is square with the chassis? Any specific measurements I should check?

I don't know the angle, I bought the whole '32 kit from speedway, and it came with the brackets that weld to the chassis and connect to the radius rods. My only thought there is that a '32 frame is 6" tall whereas mine is 4", so maybe those brackets are now too short (should be 2" longer?). It has rear disks.
 
Torque steer or bump steer, pretty much the same thing.... is the drag link parallel to the tie rod now that it is under load ? If it is angling down or up to the right side steering arm, that may be the cause - the tie rod and drag link would be moving in different arcs. Ideal would be if they are parallel in both planes when the the suspension is loaded.
 
There are so many variables that can affect handling, even something as simple as air pressure in the tires. I installed an engine in a guys vette one time and taking it back to his house was a scarey experience, it was all over the road. I stopped and read the tag inside the door and adjusted the tire pressure to what the tag recommended and it was a totally different car, rode like it should. Not saying that is your problem, just an example.

Here is where I would start:

1) Square the rear end up to the frame by triangulating it from a known center point in the front of the car.

2) Now measure the wheelbase on each side, from the exact center of the rear to the exact center of the front. (make sure the front wheels are pointed straight ahead during this) If the wheelbase is off, adjust it so it is exactly the same on both sides.

3) Jack up only one front tire off the ground and shake it side to side and up and down to see if there is any movement in any of the steering linkage, kingpins, etc. If you see any movement track it down. Do the same with the other front tire.

4) Drive the car so the front tires are jammed tight against a parking curb and move the steering wheel back and forth, looking for any slop. Have someone do this while you watch the draglink and all other steering components. You want the tires locked up tight against the curb so they can't move.

5) Recheck your caster. Don't know what front end you have, but typically for an I beam type front end 7-9 degrees is what I like. Some people like less, some like more, but that works for me. A $10 Home Depot analog angle/degree finder will do the trick.

6) Recheck your toe in. There is no absolutely perfect number for all cars. Generally, 1/16 to 1/8 inch toe in is a starting place, but I have had cars that handled better with toe out. Every car is different.

7) Recheck your camber. This is the amount your tires lean in at the top or out at the top, when viewed from the front. Not much you can do here except look to see if the tires appear to be fairly straight. Actually, they should be slightly out at the top, but it is hard to see that slight difference. You are basically looking for them being WAY out either way.

8) Recheck your air pressure. On my rods it seems 28 pounds front and 24 rear is the best, but that is MY car. I had to play around with more and less until I got the ride and handling I wanted.

So, that should do it. You are looking for misalignment and worn parts. The problem could also be something not engineered properly, like steering draglink angle, but that is another animal altogether.

Don

Oh, here is one more thing to do. Put the right tires on the left and vice versa. See if the problem changes. Stranger things have happened than one tire different from the other.
 
Thanks Don, lots of great tips.

It's likely going to be the caster - I only have 5 degrees. :(

And possibly the rear end alignment - I haven't gotten to that yet.

I have cross-steer with a vega box, so the drag link arc angle doesn't really apply to this setup. The front end is a superbell 4" drop axle, all new parts everywhere in the chassis, so it's going to be my poor engineering (5 degrees) or misalignment.
 
What happens if you hit the brakes? Are you getting a lot of weight shift back to front? Any other bumpsteer issues? Rear axle somehow shifting under load torque load?
 
It stops straight. The rear end is on a 4-bar & panhard, all new with urethane bushings so I don't think it can shift around much.

It seems to follow imperfections in the road as well, overall just seems twitchy going down the road.
 
I use around 5 degrees of caster. I have heard that a panhard bar is desireable on a buggy spring front end with cross steer. I've always put one on so no experience without one.
Here's an odd suggestion; on my tub I had a very large steering wheel. Minor adjustments in steering required lots of wheel movement at the steering wheel rim. So much that it was disconcerting. I put a smaller steering wheel on and those unconscious steering adjustments you make while driving did indeed become an unthinking part of driving.
 
I put 10 degrees of caster on my axles and run vega cross steer with no panhard bar. They track straight as an arrow with zero bump steer. Proper toe setting, tire pressure and brake adjustment make all the difference in the world.
 
I aired the fronts down to 26 and made a huge difference. I think a couple more psi and it will be fine. I'm not used to these skinny bias plys.

With just a small straight 6 and manual tranny to weight the front end down, I'm thinking less pressure is needed.
 
Bob's suggestion about a panhard bar is a good one, do you have one on the car? As for air pressure, you are right about bias plies. I had to spend a few days and outtings to dial mine in. I tried 28 all the way around and the rear bounced, so I dropped to 24 and it made a big difference.

The reason I posted that list to recheck everything is that when we built my Son Don's 23 we did it in 88 days, rushing to get it ready for Turkey Run. It had terrible death wobble so we went back to square one and rechecked everything. We found the wheelbase was off 9/16 of an inch side to side. :eek: Toe in was way off, and caster was only about 4 degrees. Lots of other adjustment issues too. Once we redid everything it was a different car.

Oh, I also STRONGLY suggest every straight axle car have one of SoCal Speed Shops steering damper installed. We put one on Don's T, on my 27, and one is going on Dans rpu and my new rpu project. I can't tell you how much of a different handling car it makes. You go over RR tracks, bumps, etc and for the first time you don't clench your teeth. It will be the best $ 40 you spend ($ 80 in chrome), take my word for it, you will THANK me.

Don
 
my 2 cents worth

HI
One thing to check is the caster in relationship to the ground.
If you are using big and little tire and checking the caster to the frame its different. You may need to drop the pivot point where the bones attach to the frame, you said your's was a 4" frame rail.
On donsrods #2 check the wheel base from the outside center of the rear to the kingpin center on each side. This way if you don't have the steering or wheel straight the kingpin will corrent for that.

have fun
Tom
 
Well it was the caster. I modified the radius rod mounts to give me 9 degrees and now it tracks beautifully, no pulling, no wandering. Ahhhhh, much nicer to drive now.
 

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