Ok , now I know,the HAMB has always been that way i guess thats what threw me off.However going in the other direction I see more and more new guys and some old guys standing up to the trouble makers. If you are looking foe specific advise and use the search function properly there is a wealth of info there. I sometimes wish some one would tell the " instant knowledge seekers " to do a search first. You dont have to be nasty about it. When I as in the early planning stages of Ratzilla I discovered the HAMB , believe it or not I spent 3 months and looked at every thread they had,I saved and booked marked enough info so that i felt confident to at least to attempt to build a vehicle from scratch. They are like any other resource , you got to pick and choose. Society in general has become much less civil these days. I'm not gonna say people were better in my day , but I can tell you the thought that you might get your a** kicked kept a lot of people in line.LFE