Metric System, Lost secrets of the ancients

[bob w]

The T-Man needs a Sticky in th B.S. Lounge where he can instruct, cajole and kick against the pr--ks.

 

[moparcowboy]

I'll just go back to busting my knuckes and welding and beating on tin cause I'm lost with all that what ever you called it

 

[Torch]

ok, so a wealth of information, but as far as the comment on a cubit and 1/12th and all that..... a cubit according to all i understand (biblical-type education) a cubit is about 18" -not 12" it was based on the average length of a man's fore arm--elbow to end of fingers... using Goliath as an example, the KJV says he was 6 cubits and a span... a cubit being approximately 18", and a span was about 9 inches, or the distance from tip of middle finger to base of the wrist.... accordingly, the guy was almost 10 ft tall...


and to add to Samfear's comment... the Farenheit system does have something to do with saltwater--the freezing point of seawater is 0 degree farenheit... the "ratios" within the system i do not know ...

Yeah I got sumftin screwed in cross threaded on that one
"Trying to figgure out these new wheels" OMG that was a good one

Actually the cubit-forearm thing that's not so much a myth but a "rule of thumb" like saying the thumb's width is roughly an inch.
I got something screwed up with the cubit and the inches but what the whole thing is about is the rule of thumbs everyone talks about like the kings thumb and the forearm...that's folklore. things said around the campfire by those who don't know the truth because it sounds good and it makes sense.
I always wondered why 60 seconds in a minute...60 minutes in an hour but then it jumps to 24 hours in a day.
It doesn't make sense without knowing that they didn't start with seconds to minutes to days...
They started with a full trip around the sun same as a full trip hands of a clock make around a circle.
There is a ton of reading I've forgotten from reading about ancient astronauts and forgotten knowledge,
stuff like the Sumerians had a name for every major body in our solar system and they numbered them from pluto to the earth, not from the earth to pluto as we do sitting here the 3rd planet from the sun...
The Sumerians numbered the planets from the outside in as one would do(assumed) if he were travelling here from a far off place.

The way our old style measurement system was developed was handed down to us from at least 10,000 years ago developing along the way but it remained intact up until the invention of the metric system.

The linear measurements we use such as inches, feet, degrees etc.. and the circular measures of degrees,minutes,and seconds of arc(circular) equal to degrees,minutes, and seconds of time are divine values and ratios discovered by ancient astronomers, mathematicians, and philosophers. they were not arbitrary measurements invented by placing a body part next to something.
They watched the sky and the movement of the stars taught them first how to measure the sky, then that technology became our everyday way of measuring the simple things near to us.
They knew 10,000 years ago the Earth was round, they sailed it and they accurately mapped it. they knew the earth went around the sun, they calculated how big the earth was and how far it travelled around the sun... 10,000 years ago.

That truth is more amazing than any fairy tale they told me in school about a kings thumb.
Christopher Columbus? not the first European here, the vikings were here and the ancient pheonecians etc.
Cairo Illinois? where the Ohio and Mississippi rivers come together? It's called little Egypt because how the lay of the land resembles greater Egypt. roughly 2,000 years ago Egyptians escaping the Roman occupation settled there in the tip of Illinois according to Indian lore and archaeological finds.
Oceans and rivers are not barriers, they are Highways.
The old way of measuring things has such a rich and incredible history to it, it makes metrics look like dumbness for dummies which is probably why they never taught me the truth about the old system when they were glorifying the metric system... or maybe they just didn't know...like most people still don't know'

Ancient map of Antarctica before it had an icecap? google admiral Piri Reis map. It had an icecap when the admiral had the map copied from an older one probably in the library of Alexandria. it accurately shows rivers streams, lakes, mountains etc. of Antarctica.. Scientists hold that Antarctica has been covered in a sheet of ice for at least 10,000 years, about the same age as the flood damage on the Sphynx.

 

[Torch]

So what's your point on a car forum? [S

Toad

Measuring shi#

on another thread a guy said how much he hated import cars and I said really the worst thing about them is they use the wrong sized tools.... got to thinking about the metric system and how simpleton it was and i posted most of what you first read on the guys thread then thought after finding no threads on the metric system hey why not make it my own thread.

If you take a bolt with 10 threads per inch.... and you have a hex nut on it... you now have a micrometer.
If you were to draw a line on the threads and turn the nut...each point of the nut as it passed the line would move the nut 1/60th of an inch down the bolt.

take a bolt with 100 threads per inch and a nut marked out in 100 degrees... if you draw a line on the bolt across the threads each time one of the 100 lines on the nut pass the line on the bolt... the nut moves 1/10,000 or .0001 of an inch That's how they figured out how to measure something small. Having a bunch of threads engaged averages out any machining irregularities in the bolt and nut making the arrangement accurate as hell.

 

[Torch]

and to add to Samfear's comment... the Farenheit system does have something to do with saltwater--the freezing point of seawater is 0 degree farenheit... the "ratios" within the system i do not know ...

...The ratios in the system with celcius it's just mark freezing point and boiling point on a thermometer and make out 100 steps each degree 1/100th of the distance between the two.

With fahrenheit the distance between freezing and boiling is marked off in 180 steps. I'm assuming there might be some connection with the idea to use 180 steps because 180 degrees is also half of the way around a circle and freeze to boil and back to freeze would be 360 degrees difference on the fahrenheit scale.

Gotta remember that Alchemy was still being practiced at this time so choosing 180 degrees might have been a philosophical choice rather than a scientific one.

 

[Torch]

It's F'ng god awful complicated and if you forget a piece of the puzzle it gets all messed up in your head but in those moments when you finally get your mind wrapped around it and it all comes together it's so freaking beautiful to see how it all relates and it makes the metric system math look like something you picked up from a dollar store... it works, but your missing out on so much more.

I didn't see it until I stumbled on it researching the ancient astronaut stories and started reading up on ancient Egypt, the geometry of the pyramids, ancient astronomy and such things. It got me back into math.

2 ways Information can be taught is:
1) so the student grasps a basic ability to use the knowledge without needing to understand the full concept. here we are teaching how, not why
2) so the student grasps a full knowledge of not just how to use the information but how the knowledge was achieved

understanding the basic way, you can use the tech, you can use the knowlege but it really isn't a part of you and you have not been made to go through the mental exercises the person discovering the knowlege had to go through.
Things learned this way are learned by rote. repetition and memorizing.

Knowing, you can yourself discover new tech. If the teacher guides you through the process of discovery that the person who discovered the knowledge experienced, then even if you forget the details about what you memorized...you can think your way back through it and figure out the puzzle the same as the original guy who discovered it. Some people in society don't want everyone that smart and it takes a lot more work to teach it that way.

give a man a fish vs teach him to fish vs teach him how to build a fishing pole so he stops borrowing yours lol

 

[Torch]

wow you know all of that and I can't even figure out my new watch I just got!!!

NICE!

 

[echnidna]

The type of measurement system we use is really unimportant as long as we understand it well enough to use it.

I learned feet & inches but when Australia converted to metric somewhere around the 60's we all had to learn the foreign metric system.

Having experienced both systems hands on I much prefer the metric system as its far simpler to use. Australia used a "soft conversion" so that 25mm = 1 inch, or 300mm = 1 foot, this helped make the transition much easier than using a precise mathematical conversion.

For example it's a lot easier to remember 347mm than 1 ft 1 & 7/8 inches.
Its also easier to read out on a ruler.

But to each his own, it's only what we are used to doing easily .

 

[Sam_Fear]

180 is easily divisible by 1/2, 1/3, and 1/5.

The metric system is a scientific system designed so that scientists have cleaner calculations to work with. Even scientists don't like fractions. 1/32" is easier for the average guy to deal with, 0.03125" is easier for the scientist.

And how about PI? Obviously God had a sly grin when he came up with that one - 'Oh...this'll freak 'em out.. heh heh!'

 

[Torch]

metrics- It is easier to work with across the sciences.

I was never taught the background of how the old measurements were discovered so I always thought of them as needlessly complicated...
But the empirical measurements we used prior to the metric system have a rich history of discovery that is lost with their dismissal that is not taught in school. they just teach you how to use it, not where it really comes from.


Now for some real mind benders....

I bet you think time really exists like there is an actual past present and future...
What if the only thing that exists in the physical world is NOW and there isn't any scify past or future to travel to?

You ask anyone to prove time exists and they will point to a clock and say see! time!
You assume that a clock is time or represents time. Maybe it's just a circle with degrees and 2 lines that rotate around the center.
I'd say that the past and future are only mental constructs the mind has created to resolve memory(past) from experience(present) and imagination(future) so you don't go mad and that time is only an idea not a thing or a place.

But I always just accepted that time was real because I was taught to without ever thinking for myself about it and spent years contemplating the many intricacies of time travel without ever once questioning the existence of time itself.

Same thing with Gravity. were taught it is a force or a field. what if it is not? Why doesn't the "gravitational field" couple with that of electricity or magnetism?
What if it is just the result of something else going on which we cannot see?

magnetism... you assume the magnetic field of a magnet is a property of the magnet. that the field moves when you move the magnet...
Truth is (mind blowing) that the magnetic field is a property of space that the magnet is in... When you move the magnet the magnetic field remains fixed in space but collapses (at a certain speed) and a new field is created at the new location of the magnet... You are not moving the field you are moving the magnet which abandons the old field and creates a new field.

Point is this. You assume it is as it appears because you were told it was this way and you never questioned it

My original post about the metric system which led to this thread was in response to a guy being intimidated by modern tech and getting a sky hi repair bill. I highlighted how just because something is new that it isn't created out of new knowledge just out of new styling and application of legacy tech and not to be intimidated since all cars old and new are built from the roughly same tech even though there is this prevalent BS out there that new things are created out of some mysterious secret sauce only a factory trained expert has knowledge of so don;t just accept what your told think for yourself, the problems are easy to solve

 

[jmlcolorado]

metrics- It is easier to work with across the sciences.

I was never taught the background of how the old measurements were discovered so I always thought of them as needlessly complicated...
But the empirical measurements we used prior to the metric system have a rich history of discovery that is lost with their dismissal that is not taught in school. they just teach you how to use it, not where it really comes from.


Now for some real mind benders....

I bet you think time really exists like there is an actual past present and future...
What if the only thing that exists in the physical world is NOW and there isn't any scify past or future to travel to?

You ask anyone to prove time exists and they will point to a clock and say see! time!
You assume that a clock is time or represents time. Maybe it's just a circle with degrees and 2 lines that rotate around the center.
I'd say that the past and future are only mental constructs the mind has created to resolve memory(past) from experience(present) and imagination(future) so you don't go mad and that time is only an idea not a thing or a place.

But I always just accepted that time was real because I was taught to without ever thinking for myself about it and spent years contemplating the many intricacies of time travel without ever once questioning the existence of time itself.

Same thing with Gravity. were taught it is a force or a field. what if it is not? Why doesn't the "gravitational field" couple with that of electricity or magnetism?
What if it is just the result of something else going on which we cannot see?

magnetism... you assume the magnetic field of a magnet is a property of the magnet. that the field moves when you move the magnet...
Truth is (mind blowing) that the magnetic field is a property of space that the magnet is in... When you move the magnet the magnetic field remains fixed in space but collapses (at a certain speed) and a new field is created at the new location of the magnet... You are not moving the field you are moving the magnet which abandons the old field and creates a new field.

Point is this. You assume it is as it appears because you were told it was this way and you never questioned it

My original post about the metric system which led to this thread was in response to a guy being intimidated by modern tech and getting a sky hi repair bill. I highlighted how just because something is new that it isn't created out of new knowledge just out of new styling and application of legacy tech and not to be intimidated since all cars old and new are built from the roughly same tech even though there is this prevalent BS out there that new things are created out of some mysterious secret sauce only a factory trained expert has knowledge of so don;t just accept what your told think for yourself, the problems are easy to solve

Ya know, all the math mumbo jumbo just had me confused, but now your talking something that really interests me! With the whole time, gravity and magnetism thing.
And your last line in your last post is going to become a quote in my sig line cause that's something EVeRYONE should hear every now and then!
"don;t just accept what your told think for yourself, the problems are easy to solve"

 

[Torch]

Nice truck Josh? I bought my tow dolly from the guys in ft Morgan American Tow Dolly. up on the northside of town is a shop that builds custom trailers cool operation. I bought an old blue 86 f600 from berkenkotter motors and the guys over at the trailer shop put a hitch on it for me and I tow dollyed my pickup back home to Omaha behind the f600.

ended up selling the f600 my financial situation changed and I didn't have the money to put a powerstroke in it and make it a rolloff.

I'm going to write a couple books, right now I'm just practicing One is going to be a re-examination of physics with time set as a constant instead of the speed of light...and the speed of light set as a variable with gravity explained as a physical effect of expanding space and not a force itself. I have a lot of math to learn and catch up on but I don't need to do years of experimentation since the theory is a compatible theory with existing theory but uses different assumptions.
I call it differential modelling.
Just like with algebra you can do differential calculus by creating different models of any algebraic equation then inter compare them to learn new relationships between the unknowns...
I think you can build different functional models of reality off the original science to discover new secrets the original experimentation proves but the existing model does not reveal.

 

[Torch]

I have this cosmic model where we have the big bang and space expanding as observed, yet it answers the question of what happens at the end of the cosmos..
They think it will either accelerate into cold dead universes, expand into cold dead universes, or slow down eventually to collapse back into a new big bang.
I have a way of showing it can continue to expand at a constant rate and never cool down.
I also show gravity as an effect of space expanding.
In my model the speed of light is infinite...well not really. I set the speed of light as "NOW" or instantaneous. that is not infinite because instantly is finite, exact, a known quantity.
so why doesn't light travel at the speed of now?
Because space impedes light, slows it down.
But how can space slow down light without absorbing energy from it? because space and light are elemental and opposed. matter can absorb and radiate light and can be influenced by the flow and movement of space because particles of matter is the vortex created when space impeded light and light impacts space. the light travelling through space is sometimes forced into a spherical waveform creating matter.
If the waveform is harmonic meaning the dimensions match the wavelength of light then it remains a stable particle.
If it is disharmonic then it continues to degrade into weaker and weaker particles as it releases fractal quanta.
Radiation is just light that cannot fold into a stable resonant waveform
Fractal quanta of light (radiation) striking harmonic quanta(matter) causes the matter to become disharmonic and it can itself become radioactive and decay.
the radiation can be reflected or re-emitted leaving the matter inactive and stable but there are instances where the collision disrupts the harmonic of the waveform significantly enough to cause it to become indelibly disharmonic and begin to decay into radiation.
So light travels through space from A to B in a relatively straight line along the path of least resistance. this is when light travels as if it were a particle. The light is not a hard particle but a wave in space that travels the inside surface of a bubble. The bubble is created when light impacts space and it is the size of a photon. this bubble travels along a straight line but it has an axis.
Not so much a bubble it looks more like a fat donut. It's called a toroid
the light runs through the center of the bubble in the direction of travel then curves out in a shield-like wave which curves back on itself at it's equator then the light goes back through the center from the rear to the front.
In this form light travels in a straight line at 186k miles per second... the toroid wave does.
Within the wave... the light is actually travelling farther because it's going in a circular motion as the toroid moves through space so if the toroid is travelling at 186kmps...the light must be travelling faster because it has to go farther.
The toroid waveform goes through space in a straight line but the light that makes up the toroid actually screws itself through space. well... screw through space is a 2 dimensional analogy of a 3 dimension process not exactly accurate but it highlights the more complex path the light travels in expressing itself as a particle and it also explains how light is both a wave and a particle.
imagine an atom not of a complex bunch of particles but of a complex resonance that multiple wavelengths of light is locked into. this explains the non-local quality of the electron within the electron shell.
you normally think of atoms as elementary particles and the idea that matter is actually the interaction of light and space seems impossible. what about friction? you have to have conservation of energy right? opposing things create friction disruption and loss...
Not when the opposing things are elemental and incompatible. one cannot absorb from the other but one can force against the other how is it possible?
I propose that light and space are the 2 qualities of nature which nothing can be reduced beyond. light and space...force and field. there is nothing more elemental for light or space to lose energy to.

so if space impedes light
and light travels at the speed of now
and we observe light travelling at 186k mps
then the difference between instant travel and the observed speed (taking into account the full complex pattern light travels in the toroid...) You can calculate the impedance of space and represent it as a constant replacing the speed of light.
You can also compare the instant travel against the speed of a toroid , the speed of the light within the toroid, and the impedance of space to map the flow of space and find the origin of the big bang, map various invisible currents in space...lots of things we can't figure out how to do yet.

the magnet actually pinches space. it neither creates or destroys energy it is passive as the conservation of energy law attests....
it doesn't pump space into motion but it locks into it and grabs a hold by dilating the flow of space through the atoms. when you move the magnet with your hand you move space through this coupling, your actually grabbing space and moving it but the grab the magnet has on space it not solid it's pretty mushy so your just moving space a little not really enough to rip it.
The flow of space is from the big bang outward but locally as we experience it...it is outward in all directions not in streams we can readily observe except in rare instances when we change it's direction like observing magnetism

 

[Torch]

So as space is flowing outward in all directions from the big bang and it impedes light... it drags along with it matter.
the space within the earth and the atoms of the earth is expanding and so is the space within you and your atoms
but the space between you and the earth is expanding at a different speed. it's a weird effect of 3 dimensional expansion the same thing is happening cosmically causing red shift.
so the result is neither you nor the earth appear to be getting any larger but the earth is always pushing against your feet as the impedance of expanding space drags you and the earth closer together. your not crushed because the impedance of space on light is pretty slippy and the "gravity" is constant throughout the universe because it's a physical quality of the universal expansion of space resulting from the big bang and not a itself a force or field.

So what happens as the cosmos expands from the big bang? space expands... and as space expands...it's impedance on light diminishes and light travels faster.
Your not speeding up light...remember my new constant the moment of now? light travels instantly unless impeded? Light naturally returns to it's native speed of now in the absence of impedance. so conservation of energy is maintained.
|As the universe expands to infinity then light accelerates maintaining balance from our perspective.
At the limits of the model when space has expanded until it has become nothing then light would fill space and everything would happen in an instant. You could call that ascension or heaven... Physical Nirvana
My model has space always approaching but never reaching that moment so the expansion of the cosmos is constant yet never cooling into cold dead nothingness

 

[busteddrum]

Entities must not be multiplied beyond necessity, it is turtles all the way down.

(apologies to Russell and Sagan)

 

[Torch]

Now this new model is going to upset some people. But I didn't create it to replace conventional physics.
I created it from conventional physics as a re interpretation of assumptions.
I think it has value in showing us relationships between light and space that conventional physics cannot and when you overlay my model upon the more conventional models it can guide conventional science to new discoveries in it's own interpretation.
It's like solving a real life problem in your dream then using the solution in real life and finding it works.
People are going to be angry that my model unlocks the speed of light and makes the moment of now the new universal constant by elimination of time. there is no more time..no past, no future, only the present moment represented as speed of light=now
I think, I'm not sure but I think taking into consideration the relationship between light and space and establishing the speed of light and now I think you might be able to represent the energy in space as E=MC^3 where C is the conventional observed speed of light not it's native unimpeded speed of now.

so there would be no time travel possible nor would there be a grand unified field theory linking electricity and magnetism with gravity...
BUT! I believe it would allow for faster than light travel...travel from here to there in an instant! like teleportation. and I also think it will reveal sources of free energy so we could have anti-gravity, flying saucers, free energy, and transporters and warp speed but just not time travel.

Differential Modelling... if gravity and time are unknowns you cannot solve for...move them to the other side of the equation. simple.

 

[Torch]

Entities must not be multiplied beyond necessity, it is turtles all the way down.

(apologies to Russell and Sagan)

Turtles? bring me up to speed on that i dont remember

My theory relies heavily on the works of Paramahamsa Tewari and John T Nordberg.

Paramahamsa Tewari modeled particles of matter as bubbles of void in space created by the impact of light on space

Nordberg http://grandunification.com/ in his balls of light theory models matter as liquid balls of light in space and establishes

(The electric field vector cross the magnetic field vector equals the gravitational field vector.)

both are kinda interchangeable but I'm going with Paramahamsa Tewari's theories in my model

Paramahamsa Tewari was born on January 6, 1937, and graduated in Electrical Engineering in 1958 from Banaras Engineering College, India, and held responsible positions in large engineering construction organizations, mostly in Nuclear Projects of the Department of Atomic Energy, India. He was also deputed abroad for a year at Douglas Point Nuclear Project, Canada. He retired in 1997 from his position as Executive Nuclear Director, Nuclear Power Corporation, Department of Atomic Energy, India, and is the former Project Director of the Kaiga Atomic Power Project. http://tewari.org/index.html

 

[echnidna]

The half smart people can be the dumbest plods in the world and might see your theorizing as an attack on their grasp of knowledge. Though super bright people are aware that the only thing that is set in concrete is the foundations of their house so they may be more likely to sit back and evaluate the considerations you are posing.

But getting your hands dirty while building a rod is much more fun.

 

[Torch]

Long as they buy the book, buy it cuz you like it buy it cuz you hate it lol just buy the book.
I was listening to Art Bell one night and it amazed me the attention some people get with no formal education but ending up the head expert of some bs they made up about bigfoot or ghosts or the spirits that know the future etc.
I was thinking... if you really went to another dimension or met aliens that shared secrets with you or any of that you would be standing here trying to explain to us what you saw but you would have no words to describe what you saw...but instead..every one sounds like they are reading from the same scify novel just repeating different versions of the same scify jingo and none of it sounds original. I would expect some degree of inability to relate the experience but nooooo they explain it so perfectly.

I was wondering why do some people fall for this don't they realize none of it makes sense?
I thought maybe they acknowledge it makes no sense to them
But the charlatan sounds so confident and knowledgeable that it makes sense to him...
And if it makes sense to him but not us...then he is a genius we are unfit to question...
I think that's how it goes.

so I got to thinking some more...these Ideas I have, they could fit into a single theory
And if a nut can become a well paid expert on demon possession or bigfoot hairstyles then maybe I could sell some books and inspire some new thought just questioning reality and offering a few reasonable alternative possibilities.
If anything pass the ideas along and get them out there in other people's heads in case something happens to me and I can't finish them.
j

 

[Torch]

The half smart people can be the dumbest plods in the world and might see your theorizing as an attack on their grasp of knowledge. Though super bright people are aware that the only thing that is set in concrete is the foundations of their house so they may be more likely to sit back and evaluate the considerations you are posing.

But getting your hands dirty while building a rod is much more fun.

If you ain't got but half a grip on anything your gonna lose all the grip you got taking a swing at a guy lol
Aw man especially if it could be inspred by ...let me see did someone say...SATAN

LOL check this out lol