Fiberglass bodies and wood...?

[donsrods]

The problem is, fiberglass really has very little strength or resistance to flexing on it's own. That is why most people put wood in it.......same as with boats, they have stringers.

Some manufacturers, like Spirit Industries are using a fiberglass innerliner, but some owners have reported problems, like cracking due to the steering column being bolted to just glass.

I think the wood way is at least proven, and really isn't a whole lot of work in the grand scheme of things.

Don

 

[hitman]

Thank you for not being offended, nor upset with my questioning of you. You answered my question exactly. Thank you. I was simply wondering what the thinking is/was behind all the cutting and fitting of the side wall stringers. Now I know. I talked to my buddy last night when I swung by the ole' shop on the way home and explained to him as you did with me. He looked at me squarely and shook his head and said it was not necessary. I guess everyone has there own opinion. My guess is, he intends on selling it a month or two after he finishes it anyway. I would be surprised if he didn't sell it right away.

 

[Tripper]

Skinnin' a cat!

There r of course more than one ways to skin a cat but in this case... I think I'd do it Don's way!

BoB

 

[donsrods]

No offense taken whatsoever. There are bunches of ways to do things. But I like wood, and my '27 was glassed up 17 or 18 years ago, and not one stress crack has developed, so I will stick with something that works for me.

Here is a picture I saved of what happens if you don't properly strengthen glass bodies.

Don

 

[T2T]

This is interesting....................................The steel is in contact with the fiberglass in only a few areas.
These guys know what they are doing. Thanks everyone for the input............

http://www.wescottsauto.com/body-steel/p-steel-1.htm

 

[donsrods]

Yep, see what they say on that information you posted...................



In some places, for structural integrity, the fiberglass shell is glued to the steel cage. A special adhesive is used, only on engineered flanges and jambs, not to the outer panels. These areas are not visible on the exterior.



They are using some adhesive to glue the steel to the glass, but only in places like hinge flanges, etc. If they tried doing it on all the steel surfaces, shadowing and cracking would become the problem. I think no matter what you tried to do, the steel would eventually seperate from the glass.

Good info, thanks for posting that.


Don

 

[35Mastr]

Don,You have hit it on the nail again.There are alot of opinions with metal to glass and wood to glass.Never personally built boats but have spent the last ten years or so rebuilding alot of them.Glass is the best bet to wood that I have ever seen.Unless there ever get any moisture between any stringers or any wood surfaces they are better than steel anyday.I have seen some old srtingers that were glassed right and never rotted or ever had any water damage.Some were close to 30+ years old.

 

[ouh506]

Zipper uses steel.

www.zippermotors.com

 

[dawg]

There are several great adheisives for bonding glass to steel, we use them in the automotive collision industry every day. I think the key here has already been aluded too, in that the steel contact patches are designed into the structure. To each his own for wood or steel. For the home builder, wood has it's advantages. In reality, no matter the choice, it's the outcome of the workmanship that delivers...

 

[Youngster]

Don... this is a great and timeless post. I'm sure you have turned on the light at the end of the tunnel for a lot of people. I have done a few 'glass T bodies and would like to add my $0.02.

When I install the wood around the top of the body, I wrap a piece of cardboard around the outside of the body and trace the shape onto it. Next I layout this tracing onto a piece of pine and cut it out. A second line is drawn 1 1/2'' below the edge and cut out. Saw cuts are made at a 90* from the top edge, leaving a 1/16'' of the wood uncut. You should be able to form the wood strip to the inside of the body now. After cleaning and roughing up the mating surface of the body, I mix up some Dyna glass and spread it in the contact area of the body and in the kerfs of the wood strip. The strip is then clamped to the body. Use a putty knife to remove any excess Dyna glass and let it set up. Now you can tab the wood with 'glass mat.

here's a tip for tranfering a contour from the body to the wood for your vertical stringers. After the floor and the top srtingers are 'glassed in place, cut a piece of cardboard to fit between the two and trim it to fit within 1/4'' of the body. Now take a washer that has 1/4'' or more difference between the inside and outside dia. and hod it flat on the cardboard. Put your pencil in the hole and roll the washer along the body. Cut the contour out and transfer it to your wood. Cut out the stringer and dyna glass the mating surfaces and etc.

One more thing then I'll stop. I have used bodies from Speedway, MAS, Total and Anderson Ind. Some are better than others, but I don't see that much difference in them by the time you add wood. They all need to be worked on the out side to get them straight enough for paint. It seems a lot of people think they can just scuff and paint. That is not the case.

Youngster

 

[Youngster]

Don... this is a great and timeless post. I'm sure you have turned on the light at the end of the tunnel for a lot of people. I have done a few 'glass T bodies and would like to add my $0.02.

When I install the wood around the top of the body, I wrap a piece of cardboard around the outside of the body and trace the shape onto it. Next I layout this tracing onto a piece of pine and cut it out. A second line is drawn 1 1/2'' below the edge and cut out. Saw cuts or kerfs are made at a 90* from the top edge, leaving a 1/16'' of the wood uncut. You should be able to form the wood strip to the inside of the body now. After cleaning and roughing up the mating surface of the body, I mix up some Dyna glass and spread it in the contact area of the body and in the kerfs of the wood strip. The strip is then clamped to the body. Use a putty knife to remove any excess Dyna glass and let it set up. Now you can tab the wood with 'glass mat.

Here's a tip for tranfering a contour from the body to the wood for your vertical stringers. After the floor and the top srtingers are 'glassed in place, cut a piece of cardboard to fit between the two and trim it to fit within 1/4'' of the body. Now take a washer that has 1/4'' or more difference between the inside and outside dia. and hold it flat on the cardboard. Put your pencil in the hole and roll the washer along the body. Cut the contour out and transfer it to your wood. Cut out the stringer and dyna glass the mating surfaces and etc.

One more thing then I'll stop. I have used bodies from Speedway, MAS, Total and Anderson Ind. Some are better than others, but I don't see that much difference in them by the time you add wood. They all need to be worked on the outside to get them straight enough for paint. It seems a lot of people think they can just scuff and paint. That is not the case.

Youngster

 

[Sample]

Sorry to bring up an old post, but how would I go about extending a t-bucket body 30" or so?

Thanks,
Chris

 

[donsrods]

There is an excellent thread right on here that I ran across, it shows how he did it.

http://ratrodsrule.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9242
Don

 

[jfg455]

Just read the whole post. Very informative. Good job Don!

Hey Mods! Why is this not a sticky yet? This thread has some valubale info in here.

 

[2nd gear]

Thanks so much for posting this process. Im going to tackle a bucket this spring when the weather breaks here in michigan! You made it look so easy. Im feeling better about doing this after reading your post! [cl[cl[cl[cl

 

[donsrods]

Fiberglassing is one of those skills that once you do a little bit of it you will think you have been doing it forever. It is also a very forgiving medium and if you make a mistake you cut it out and start over. The main thing to remember is to grind the areas where you are glassing to rough it up and give it some tooth, and to dewax those areas first so you don't grind the wax into the scratches.

That, and to keep some baby oil and womens panty hose around to get the fiberglass slivers out of your pores. I itch just thinking about it.


Don

 

[rex1927]

Wood and fiberglass work great together.

My brother will go under deck of boats and grind out large holes where struts and rudders have been snatched off by running aground.It shatters the glass and large areas have to be removed back to undamaged glass to start repair.He can grind all day under there.When he comes out for a break,he is solid white.He just blows off with air hose and goes on like it is nothing.
I would go insane!!!!

 

[donsrods]

Yeah, I know some old fishermen who repair their trawlers all the time and they have had so much fiberglass on their skin over the years it doesn't phase them any more.

I did learn a couple of clean up tricks that help. Get in the shower with the hottest water you can stand and put baby oil all over yourself and use a scrub brush and brush in one direction only. It will pull the slivers out of the pores and the water will rinse them away on the oil. And, a pair of pantyhose brushed over your skin briskly in one direction will pull them out of the pores too.

The only problem is that as a single guy I feel a little strange going in and buying panty hose.

Don

 

[King Herald]

I sort of got used to the glass itch myself, after a few sessions grinding and sanding. You need to wear a dust mask though, as your lungs never get 'used' to the stuff.

I actually used steel frame in my RPU, glassed in in quite a few places. I plan to squirt some of that expanding foam into any spaces or gaps to stiffen it all up and bond it a bit better when I get on the finishing stretch.

Early days, not glassed in yet:

I did this on my previous project and swore I'd never do it again, as it takes a shedload of time. But somehow I did.


Glassed in several places:

The floor was put in just like Don showed several years ago on this thread. Tranny tunnel was cut later, tunnel was made from 1/8" plywood and glassed over.

I quite like fibreglass. [cl

.

 

[old man dave]

I have always heard putting baby powder on your skin before starting fiberglass work helps to keep the dust from sticking. Unless you live in the swelter belt and you are working during the summer.