I'm Gonna Build A Dragster!

[sgtpontiac]

Still a bummer.....

I totally understand the stay in an work on something other than hit a show and shine or race thing.....gotta do what makes ya happy.....nothing else factors in....... can you really have too many cars????? [S

 

[BlueNorther]

like this very much, almost has me motivated into reviving my old 57 chev drag car. Almost! still recovering from 2 yr 4 mnth UE adventure.

those carbs would be more effective turned around 180 degrees, going backwards now. gas will move to the back of float bowl on acceleration, away from jets and power valve intake. not the best for acceleration.

BETTER yet, replace them with 3 - Holley/weber 5200 series 2 bbls from 71-74 Pinto 2.3, they were built by Holley with permission from Weber, they are very tunable. a freind had one on a Pinto 4cyl. circle track car and it screamed. they have progressive secondary opening, so are very throttle responsive.

Tuning parts are available from weber, you can make air fuel adjustments from idle to the extreme top end. they have the normal idle mix screw, but also have changeable air bleeds, changeable emulsion tubes to fine tune mid range and top end jetting, to go along with the regular jets we all know and love. just make sure all are the exact same P/N and year.

I'm sorry I wasted my time and your's trying to help make this a better solution.

 

[bob w]

After the fiasco at the strip a couple weeks ago I put the car away in the deepest darkest corner of the back garage. I kept thinking about everything that went wrong and decided today that I can change the carbs and test it out on the street before we get too frozen up here.
After supper I made a new top plate that will mount 3 Holley 1 barrels. On the original $100 Craigslist engine 2 Holley 1 barrels seemed to work pretty good. Hopefully, the modified engine will like the three Holleys.

BlueNorther, sorry I missed your last post. Someone just let me know you seem P.O.'d. I read your original post and appreciate the information provided. Realized that rotating the carbs would be a good idea based on your post. The use of the later carbs you suggested is a good idea but they are a little too modern looking for what I am trying to do here. You certainly didn't waste my time with your suggestions.

No Sgt., you can't have too many cars. However sometimes I feel like a fleet maintenance guy that is failing at the task.

 

[bob w]

Worked on fuel lines and throttle linkage today.

 

[BlueNorther]

Sorry! didn't mean to come off so snippy sounding. too much dayquil, damn fall head cold.

actually I think the origins of the weber VGS and DGS carbs go back into the fifties Italian and german performance car era. the designs were updated for the seventies mileage and emmissions requirements when holley paid royalties to weber to build the carbs. my friend with the oval track car found an out of print book by an English author from the late Sixties that went way beyond the basic clean and rebuild type thing. Even listing rare parts and where to find them. his 2.3 liter mustang would pull hard from 3000rpm and not stop until it got to 9-10,000 rpm range.

 

[bob w]

I did look for those carbs at the swap meet at the fairgrounds a couple weeks ago. No luck. Will check at the Roadster's swap meet this Sunday. It's pretty easy to try different carbs. Just have to keep making new top plates.

Thanks for the additional information, BlueNorther.

 

[BlueNorther]

tried and failed to find the name of the book by the brit.

did find the German web pages listing various weber carbs ( VERGASERS! ) and some kits for them.

about a third of the way down is the 32/36DGAV that is the grandaddy of the holley/weber colaboration.

and right below it is the mother of all nasty little 2 venturi carbs, the 38DGAS, a syncronious 2 barrel, that was used on english Ford 2.8 and 3.0 liter Granada's and Consul's, and on the early Cortina rally cars before they went to injection.

of interest might be the ultra expensive and ultra rare 40DFI at the bottom of the page as used on the 365 Ferrari. the 365 used 6 of them in a row down the middle of a V12.

might have some luck finding the holley/weber where the 4 cyl oval racers buy and sell.

 

[BlueNorther]

forget the pinto based carbs and use the autolite 2100 series 2bbls made from 1957 to early 80's. they come in cfm's ranging from 190cfm to 424cfm. Poor man's Holley 2bbl.

they are marked with the diameter of the venturi in the following order.

0.98 = 190cfm

1.01 = 240

1.02 = 245

1.08 = 287

1.14 = 300

1.21 = 351

1.23 = 356

1.33 = 424


the .98 thru 1.33 number is stamped on the side of the float bowl. should be available in rebuildable condition for $30-$50 each and carb kits are easily found, as are most parts for them.

mount 3 of them 1.01's with the front of the carb facing the passenger side (right) of the car, which would put the needle and seat at the rear of the carb. Which means on acceleration the float would drop and gas would flow easy into float chamber and on braking the gas would go forward and push needle closed, there by limiting the gas in the float bowl.

they are super easy to tune as the only variations are the size of the main jet and the diameter of the gas passages in the power valve restrictions.

don't know if this little drag car is a dead issue or just on back burner, as I see you're working on the Reo/Chev thing.

but I just found this info and thought I should share it with you, as I have to live my drag racing vicariously through you.

 

[bob w]

BlueNorther, Thanks for the carb information. I spent the last couple days rearranging stuff so I can get the dragster into the front garage. I plan on running it at the Meltdown Drags in Byron, Ill. in July. As you can see I'm going to try three Holley 1 bbls. However, based on your post, I'll start searching for Autolites at the upcoming swap meets.

It's unfortunate that you depend on my little dragster for some drag racing thrills as I hardly ever actually get out there to race. I talk a good game but get lazy when it comes to racing.

Being a builder before everything else, there is another dragster floating around in the back of my mind. Mid-50's Chassis Research style with a 300 in Ford 6. I need to find very good deals on a narrow rear end and wire front wheels.

 

[BlueNorther]

that's quite the coincidence, because I've been drawing plans for a 144" FED dragster with a SBC for power, mostly stock 400ci with TH400 and set up for bracket 1, running right around 10.30 or so. something cheap to run and maintain. those specs are dependent on the parts I have laying around and the room I have to store the car.

But then I get to thinking ( sometimes a scary thing) that I should concentrate this effort on reviving my old 57 210 sedan drag car. But it weighs as much as the Queen Mary and needs a ton of HP to run 10's. where as the dragster would be light (1500 #'s?) and shouldn't take a monster motor to run 10's.

then again all this thinking causes stress so I go lie down and take a nap.

 

[bob w]

Finally got the dragster into the front garage. Today I finished the installation of the 3 Holley 1 bbls. I rebuilt last fall. Completed the fuel lines and throttle linkage. I threw a battery in the back and the thing started on the first crank. Now, to see if it revs without hesitation, which was the problem with the last two carb set ups.

I am registered for the Meltdown Drags near Rockford, Ill. and hope to make a decent showing with the dragster. There will be one or two other cars like mine.

Bluenorther, one thing to keep in mind is you almost need a crew member to run a dragster whereas you can run a "door" car without help.

 

[ratty 46]

Progress - always a good thing. Looking good.

 

[Dirtyrat]

When do we hear it run???

 

[Kurtm333]

Sound

Waiting to hear it!

Just got my gm 250 with side drafts running, hope to get some test runs in soon too.

Kurt

 

[bob w]

Cold and rainy today so no driveway "tests".
Click on the pic to watch and listen to a short video. I'm very anxious to see if it will run good under load. Tried running it through the gears on jack stands and it seems like 2nd gear is missing. I might have blown it when I put the kit in the valve body.

 

[BlueNorther]

Saw the video on that other site. sounds good, except for the stumble when cracking the throttle.

those Holley 1920's are known for sloppy linkage on the accelerator pump, and the gasket between the accelerator pump and carb body sometimes does not line up correctly and blocks the flow of fuel.

also the power valve may not be touching the power valve lever correctly. both of these are hidden inside float bowl.

any delay in the movement of the accel. pump or power valve can cause a stumble.

another trick is to run the idle circuit one turn rich as this effects the tip-in delay or lack there of in the change from idle circuit to main circuit.

here's a link to slant six carb / Holley 1920 pdf manual.

Holley 1920 operation and repair manual

 

[BlueNorther]

try this link

http://u225.torque.net/cars/SL6/docs/Holley_1920_Manual.pdf

 

[ronnysplymouth]

Sounds good Bob, is that slant cammed up at all....hard to tell

 

[bob w]

BlueNorther, thanks for all the information. I didn't know any of that. How did you get to be a carb expert?

ronnysplymouth, I had the cam reground by Berry Cams, a local company. It's pretty mild. Small steps, you know.

Watching the video, I realize I didn't rev it very high. Will try harder next time. Maybe make some black marks in the driveway tomorrow.

 

[BlueNorther]

worked on cars for a living from 1970 to 1990. got burned out left the auto field for some years. drag raced from mid 70's to late 80's, ran out of money and have been in remission since. carbs were kind of interesting to me, seems like black magic until you dig into them. people used to bring me their cars and ask if I could make the smog monster run like they did in the old days, and picked up a few tricks along the way. still have a few friends who race and bribe me into tinkering on their carbs, but not so much any more as we are all doddering off into old farthood.

was unemployed 2-1/2 of the last 3 years, and as soon as I applied for SS (turned 62 in march) I got an offer for a full time job in one of the big box store parts houses in town here. so, now I'm working full time and got my first SS check last month. if I can stay healthy, I should be in shape in a year or so to maybe take a shot at re-doing my old bracket car.

Good lord! Is Berry cams still going, I bought one of my first race cams from them in the 70's. They were in an old shed along highway 55 if I remember right. The older Berry running it then has to of passed on as he was ancient back then, he would be a 100+ now.